A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
Juan Carlos Cruz was not always a friend of Pope Francis, but he became one. In his youth, Cruz survived abuse at the hands of a notorious Chilean priest. The pope caused a scandal in 2018 when he defended clergy accused of letting that abuse happen, and then Pope Francis changed. He said he was wrong, apologized and invited Cruz and other survivors to visit him and share their stories. And that marked the beginning of a close friendship.
JUAN CARLOS CRUZ: He started calling me on the phone, and then I started visiting him every month. And then I moved to Spain, and I visited him every two weeks. And last Christmas, he invited me to spend it with him. And we spent all our birthdays together, his and mine. So it was a very beautiful friendship.
MARTÍNEZ: Cruz has served for years now on the Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors, a Vatican commission that advises the Catholic Church on child sexual abuse. I asked him why he believed the pope's mea culpa.
CRUZ: I had never felt an apology like his. You know, apologies just in words don't really matter, but he did things. He summoned all the Chilean bishops to Rome and told them to resign. That was a pretty important moment in the history of the church and the history of abuse because Pope Francis did what no pope did before, which is call the abuse by its name, sexual abuse, abuse of power, abuse of conscience, cover-up. Of course, he needs to do more - or he could have done more. But I think he left us on the right path, and hopefully the next pope follows through with what he started.
MARTÍNEZ: How have you been reflecting on your relationship with him?
CRUZ: I cannot believe that he died. To be honest, I get emotional thinking of this. Of course, he's the pope. And as much as I saw him and I spent afternoons with him in his little living room outside his bedroom, every time I saw him was a privilege and was like the first time. I never took it for granted. I reflect on him as a man who was in love with every human being and in love with life. And that's how I'm going to remember him, a man that cared deeply to tell everybody that they belong, no matter where they came from and who they were.
MARTÍNEZ: When you think about Pope Francis when he was elected and then Pope Francis in 2025, I mean, it sounds like, for you at least, there was a big difference in his understanding of sexual abuse in the church, like a radical change.
CRUZ: Absolutely, yeah. He was so poorly informed by the cardinals in Chile and cardinals throughout many countries. And when he had the courage to sit with victims, to hear victims, to believe them, to understand, he had a radical change. When he appointed me to the pontifical commission as his adviser, and he told me, please, help me here - help me change this and eliminate the scourge of abuse from the church. And, look, there's still a lot to do. But I'm proud of what he started and what he's done.
MARTÍNEZ: And what else would you like to see the commission do?
CRUZ: I would like the commission to continue its work. I would love the new pope to follow the line of Francis, someone who deeply cares about the horror of abuse and understands that there are still victims around the world begging for justice. Nobody in the church should be begging for justice. Until we fix that, we will not be able to move forward.
MARTÍNEZ: The Survivors Network of those Abused by Priests, known as SNAP, say it's a tragedy that the pope died without doing more for survivors. How do you see it?
CRUZ: I see it. It's a tragedy that Pope Francis couldn't do more. You know, I see from inside and from outside. And survivors agree, other survivors don't agree. I stand up to cardinals, I stand up to bishops. Even if they kick me out of the Vatican in the next papacy, I don't care. I'm going to continue doing it because it's horrific that abuse is still a thing in the church.
MARTÍNEZ: And, Juan Carlos, could you share maybe your favorite memory of you and Pope Francis?
CRUZ: (Laughter) You know, I would love to tell you hours of laughter and of his incredible sense of humor, his, you know, sometimes dad jokes.
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
CRUZ: But, you know, I'm Chilean, and he's Argentino, so we have a lot of things in common.
MARTÍNEZ: And a rivalry, too, a natural rivalry.
CRUZ: And we played that rivalry.
MARTÍNEZ: Yeah.
CRUZ: And he told me that I only watched soccer World Cups on TV while they won.
MARTÍNEZ: (Laughter).
CRUZ: And so it was like that. He was so witty and yet so wonderful to everybody. And, look, I'm going to miss him.
MARTÍNEZ: That is Juan Carlos Cruz, a friend of Pope Francis who serves on the Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors. Juan Carlos, thank you very much for sharing.
CRUZ: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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